This program is a production of WAMC News.
From Albany, this is the Legislative Gazette,
a weekly half hour review of New York State government and politics.
Your host is political scientist and syndicated columnist Dr. Alan Shartock, of the State University.
In this edition of the Legislative Gazette,
we'll explore several developments in the political arena,
including comments from the man who may emerge
as the Republican challenger to Governor Mario Cuomo next year.
Politics assumes some of the spotlight this week.
There was a new public opinion poll showing Governor Cuomo continuing to enjoy very favorable ratings.
And we'll get to that in a minute.
There was also a sharp attack on the governor by a leading Republican
and we'll be hearing from him later on as well.
But the week's strangest political story has to involve the small but occasionally influential liberal party.
This tale actually begins on October 6th.
According to some sources, somebody broke into the New York City headquarters of the party
and stole some things.
Others insist there was no actual break-in.
Hinting it may have been an inside job.
At any rate, a secret letter was removed from the files and was given to several reporters,
including New York Post-Capital Bureau Chief Frederick Udicker.
He spoke with Bill Grawlty about the letter.
That's quite a dramatic letter, Bill.
When it is a letter from the chairman of the party Donald Harrington to his chief operative,
the executive director of the party, James Nataro.
In a letter, Confedis is a strong exasperation at the difficult flight to liberal space now.
The liberals are virtually bankrupt.
They have very little political influence and they seem to have a confused leadership.
And then specifically in the letter, Harrington raises a specter of the potential or the possible need of dissolving the Liberal Party,
which has been a party of influence in this state since 1944.
He also says that he himself may resign from the party because he is so frustrated at the party's difficulties.
So it is very significant and interesting insight into the problems of what has been an important political force in this state for many years.
Does it say in there that the maker break point is an upcoming fundraising dinner?
It does. It says that the October 31 annual dinner of the party in New York City is crucial.
That if the party can't raise the significant amount of money, which I understand to be about $150,000,
that it is probably all over.
And the leader of the party, this chairman Donald Harrington, raises the possibility and the letter as well that with these difficulties that the party faces,
his arch rival in the party, a man named Raymond Harding, who used to be the party leader, might succeed in taking the party over.
And Harrington said to me that rather than have that happen, he just assumed the party.
So Harrington is giving two possible reasons for folding the party.
One, it's financial difficulties and two, the possible takeover of the party by his arch rival Raymond Harding.
Now the question is can he do it? Can he fold the party or put a party and just pick up the pieces and start his own liberal party?
Well, that's a very interesting question. To fold the party, I'm not sure of the old illegal mechanics,
but certainly it would require a vote of the state committee of that party.
And I suspect that many of the members of the state committee, rather than seeing their party go out of existence,
might respond to Harding's appeals to keep it going and allow him to take it over.
So this is going to be quite a bit of political fighting coming down the road.
Is this going to change in any way? Let's say that he does dissolve the party.
Would it make a major change in the political landscape of New York?
No, it will probably not. It might even be a change for the better.
But I don't think it would be major. What the liberal party has become in the last 10 or 12 years by most estimates
is basically a patronage machine which sells its endorsements in exchange for commitments for jobs or other favors.
The great idealism which was the moving force behind the party's creation in 1944,
which by the way was founded by Alex Rose, a great union leader and many other union and liberal political leaders,
and there's no longer there at one time the Democratic party was totally controlled by the Peminy Hall bosses.
It was viewed as basically sort of a corrupt organization.
And the labor movement and many liberals wanted a cleaner, kind of more idealistic organization.
And for a while they had that in the form of something called the American Labor Party, the ALP in New York.
But many of these labor leaders came to believe that I think quite correctly that the American Labor Party was communist control.
So in 1944 they created the Liberal Party. But the original moving force for it, the corruption of the Democratic Party,
does no longer seem to be there today. So I don't think the place at stake would be any of the worst off of that Liberal Party.
Fred Dicker is Capitol Bureau Chief for the New York Post.
Turning to another political matter, the Marist College Institute for Public Opinion released its quarterly poll,
including opinion about Governor Cuomo's performance in office.
More on that from Bill Galty.
To no one's great surprise, Governor Mario Cuomo continues to enjoy very favorable ratings.
Overall his combined excellent and good rating is 68 percent statistically unchanged from a similar poll in June.
His popularity is highest in New York City, second highest in the suburbs and lowest relatively speaking upstate,
where 63 percent still feel he is doing a good or excellent job.
Dr. Lee Marangoff, who directs the poll, says within those seemingly stagnant numbers,
there were some moderate shifts within broad ideological categories.
In June, 76 percent of the Liberals approved of his performance as a combination of the excellent and good,
that went up to 82 percent. So there was a movement among people who see themselves as liberals by six points or their bouts.
The moderate stayed almost identical, 70 to 69.8, the conservatives around the state went from 63.5 to 52.1,
falling off of about 10 points there. So although his popularity as a whole stayed unchanged statistically,
there was movement on that question in terms of the voter ideology.
One reason for the governor's continued popularity may well be the issues he identifies with,
and by the way, the people agreed by a wide margin that he takes strong stands on the issues.
Those issues are also, turns out, popular with the people of New York.
The latest example of that is opposition to President Reagan's plan to end deduction for state and local taxes.
The issues that he's identified with seem to be, or the ones he's pushed, the drinking age seatbelts.
This issue also places him really at the center of public opinion in the state.
I mean, this is a, like our surveys earlier on the drinking, raising the drinking age,
this survey shows that Cuomo's out there pushing an issue, which places him very much in touch with public opinion.
Although Governor Cuomo professes publicly not to care about public opinion polls,
these latest figures can only cheer him as he prepares for a run for a second term.
While Marangoff says one year before election day is too early to start translating poll data into votes,
there's no doubt the governor is in good shape.
Coming out of the starting blocks, presumably several months down the road,
if this data holds, Cuomo would be a very, very powerful candidate,
and the chances of beating him would be slim should this data hold.
In addition to the questions asked about Cuomo, the poll also asked, as we mentioned,
about federal tax reform and found most people opposed to ending state and local tax deductions,
and about federal spending and found most people want less spent on defense and more on social programs.
While the results of the latest Marist poll undoubtedly cheer the Cuomo forces,
they might also don't those on the Republican side.
But at least one man hasn't been scared away.
He's been hat in state senator Roy Goodman.
Senator, it's been a while since we've had you on.
You're frequently being mentioned more and more, in fact, one poll I just saw,
Republican County Chairman identify you as one of the most likely to run against Mario Cuomo.
Considering his incredible, a popularity has seen in the last week's Marist poll,
why would anybody want to run against him?
Well, Governor Cuomo has a number of very significant vulnerabilities.
At the moment these things are obscured by the fact that he has a potential presidential candidate,
hey, low, but let me assure you that those of us who are close to the capital situation in Albany
have already identified and will continue to areas of real vulnerability.
Let me have some of those just so we can sort of catch up.
Well, first of all, keep in mind that the governor has had an outstanding revolving door in the top levels of his cabinet.
He has lost his lieutenant governor, his lieutenant officials.
There has been a parade out of the Cuomo administration unparalleled in the history of the state.
I think that in the case of several of the commissioners, the parade was accompanied by very, very serious breakdown and performance.
There have been other criticisms leveled against the government by people who have been very, very close to his official family.
I might cite to you William Stern, who was the governor's principal fundraiser and his effort to become governor,
and who subsequently was, as you were aware, the chairman of the Urban Development Corporation,
one of the top slots within the power of the government to appoint to the amazement of virtually every observer I've spoken with,
Bill Stern has recently uncorked an unbelievable attack upon the governor's lack of capacity in the work that he is doing in Albany,
and he has used Praeviology, which really, I will quote him, he's called the Urban Administration Chaotic and Disorganized.
He says that there is no serious emphasis on cost-cutting or efficiency.
He has said the state government is a racket coming from one of the governor's closest confidants.
This is an astonishing attack. The Washington Post, which is certainly a democratic leaning publication, has stated,
and I quote that the closer you get to Albany, the weaker governor Cuomo looks.
They say he is a visionary and his weakness is governing.
This question of being a visionary is an interesting problem with the governor.
I certainly think he is capable of painting vivid word textures, and we could go right back to his most celebrated speech,
which he gave at the convention of the Democratic Party in San Francisco.
I thought, however, that the critique of that speech by Norman Padoritz in the New York Post of October 15th was extremely interesting.
Mr. Padoritz chose to dwell upon the governor's favorite metaphor, the comparison of the process of governing to that of one big family.
And in a rather detailed indictment of that concept, Mr. Padoritz said that Mario Cuomo is involved in a brand of extreme liberalism,
which reflects in his judgment a very unsound basis on which to govern.
I think that one could delve rather deeply into some philosophical aspects of the governor's point of view and find that he really does envisage for government a very, very intrusive role.
A role in which shot there is very little likelihood, in my opinion, that productive free enterprise of the kind that those long-term job economies would be feasible.
It looks to me as though if you would examine, for example, another very weak aspect of the governor's performance today,
is economic development-beat program that you will find that Mario Cuomo has largely been out to lunch when it comes to creating conditions in which we can build jobs, long-range and stimulate business.
Let's look at the availability of financial assistance, which the government provides to businesses.
In the state of Pennsylvania, through its development corporation, you have 5% funds available, versus New York Job Development Authority,
money's available at 9.5%. There is no way in which New York's localities are going to compete with Lancaster, Arlington, Stranton and the like,
when other states are offering these kinds of incentives. Also, there is a fundamental questioning of the role of the Urban Development Corporation.
This has been a very confused organization. Originally you will recall it was to the purpose of assisting in the development of housing in areas of the state where it was needed,
but under the Cuomo administration, the UDC has been largely dismantled as a housing entity.
It's involved largely with rolling out and rolling over existing financial commitments, and is instead supposedly involved in high-tech development. That was under Bill Stern.
Now we have a new commission of Vincent Teezy, and under Mr. Teezy it isn't that all clear that the UDC will be used for high-tech.
So we've had a full series of changes of function for one of government-based instruments, which could be helpful if it were properly focused.
Let's take a look at the question of training packages.
If you look at states such as North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama and Maryland, they will give you a single check.
Money, a cash money check for training a unified, single training package of people. In New York there are ten different sources where you have to go to try to get money for training.
When you're talking about training, there are some people out in our audience who won't understand what you're talking about. What do you think?
I think about job training. So in other words, taking groups of people and training them to perform in a particular workplace.
Yes, exactly.
And by training we mean that we have to take steel workers and train them to become computer manufacturers in the light.
And unless there are those going to be emergency assistance in the training function from government, New York will not attract new industries which potentially could come in and offer jobs to our people.
Now New York must compete with other states, many of them in the South, which I've just been numerated for you.
And let's face it, the businessmen themselves are saying New York does not begin to measure up to the Carolina's Georgia, Alabama and Maryland.
You just can't even compare what we do because of the muddled confusion and unfocused programs that we offer.
Now also there's been very heavy criticism of the running of the Commerce Department and the creation of the so-called economic czar by the governor.
First of all, he appointed a young man, Mr. Michaelson, to replace Bill Stern.
And Mr. Michaelson was reported to be a financial advisor to the Pope.
It turned out that he never met the Pope, but he was actually a very junior intern in a London firm which did some advisory work for the Vatican.
What was remarkable about this was that when the governor learned of this situation revealed by the press instead of admitting that he made a blooper, he attacked the press as a bunch of sharks out to destroy a fine young man.
When the press was fulfilling its legitimate fact-funding function, the governor's attempt to defend that situation by calling the press sharks was simply outrageous.
The fact was that he had to withdraw the Michaelson nomination.
And now he's come up with Vincent T. Z. He's a very likable chap, but businessmen themselves are commenting that Mr. T. Z. has no background whatsoever in the field of economic development.
His early training and professional work was as a bond trader and speculator.
This is not an economic development function, it's far removed from it.
And the question now arrives, why can't we go back into the era when we had professionals running the Department of Commerce and providing organized, hard-hitting programs of industrial development?
Let's continue.
The labor climate in the state.
There are very serious problems in which we have got to get the cooperation of our unions over from the most anxious to assist in building New York's long-range job economy.
But at the present time, there is no coordinated state-lobe policy. And here again, a governor must intervene to accomplish this.
Also, there's heavy business criticism of the bladed image of New York.
We spend $2 million on advertising New York's business plan, but while the governor in fact talks about the president's tax reform program, as though it were something that is inimical to a business development, which of course it is not.
To talk about tourism, we have a dribbling of matching funds. We spend about $3 million on some tour advertising, but not nearly enough to stimulate this tremendously important business builder for the state.
There are critiques of the patent policy of the area of patents and how they are administered as important to the state, serious question marks there.
And then there's the Holland-Berly-Orbit taxes. Let me just pause here and say that the governor's performance on taxes and my judgment has been telephone.
The first thing that he did was to bring about a $1.2 billion tax increase, thinly disguising it in language he can talk to to try to make it look like fees instead of taxes, but businessmen knew better.
Then the governor let a year go by to study the situation while the Republican majority and the Senate brought mounting pressure on him to make a really meaningful tax cut.
And finally, the governor ran around in front of the parade and at the end of the long session pretended that it was he who would invented the idea of the tax cut.
When in fact he'd really been a rip-band winkle and slept through the whole year in which we could have gotten vital additional leverage.
So I guess what I'm saying, Alan, is that we have some very serious problems but because the press is rather enchanted by an articulate governor who is now without question spending more time looking at the White House and paying attention to the state house, I would cite you with 14 trips delivering commencing speeches around the country, we've got a governor who really has not been paying proper attention to state business and the state is suffering.
Okay, now, Ralph, I can, let me go on and that's a good idea of where you're going to go with this thing.
First of all, we only have a few minutes because of that excellent presentation that you've just given.
So let me ask you some real fast ones. Number one, do you have commitments from county chairman should you want them to back you in your candidacy?
I have not asked anybody at any part of the state for a commitment with respect to this race because it'd be very unfair to do that until I know that I'm committed to making the race and as I repeatedly said I will not know that until January or February of this year.
What will help you make up your mind right?
Well, I'm continuing exactly as I have been for the last six months to move about the state talking with people in various parts of it to see what the climate is and to try to find out whether a good man candidacy would be viable.
I've stuck my big toe in the water, the water feels nice and comfortable so far but it would be premature to make any such suggestion at this time when we're wait till February.
They say you don't have a sense of humor out there. The governor says that when you start talking like this that you must be nipping at the X-Lax again referring to your X-Lax connections of your family. How do you take it when he says something like that?
Well, I think probably one of my hallmarks is my kit bag of anecdotes and precisely the quality of injecting a little humor into a situation.
I've excited the fact that I overheard two birds talking the other day on a telephone pole and one said are you for Cuomo and the other one sort of quesayon, he's for us.
So you see we have an all depends how you look at it. I've also said that I'll back the governor when he's right and all opposing the other 98% of the time.
If in fact, you did run you would be giving up your state senate seat which you've been in for a long time. What if the Democrat took that? Wouldn't that be a negative in terms of helping the Democrats take the senate?
Well, it is certainly true that I run in an area which is about three or one Democratic. I've been good for which to be elected repeatedly by the East side of Manhattan.
I think you're out listening to your own writing. I've had the luck to be elected by more than two birds of the most of the time that I've run in this overwomenly Democratic area.
But it is a legitimate concern as to what would happen to that seat and the entire balance of the senate is something which we're keeping a close eye on because obviously we would regard it as nothing short of a catastrophe to have the Republican lose majority control of the senate.
I think that New York would then be subject to the mercies, the unlethiful policies, attacks and spend of the Democrats and that would be very bad news. So that's certainly something we have to consider very carefully.
Right now, the governor has consistently said that he has to raise money and a lot of money in order to counter the Republicans who he says have talked about a $25 million war chest.
So briefly, is that so?
You know, this is a case of the popcorn the kettle black in which Mario Cuomo sits upon a treasure trove close to $5 million at this moment and is planning to have a fundraising dinner at which the tickets are being issued at $2500.
That's a pretty good.
It's hard for me to imagine anything more outrageous than this type of a situation. In fact, I think it's downright a cause of concern to think that anyone would try to hawk tickets at $2,500 a copy.
Who would want to buy a ticket for that much?
That would be someone with special access to ground I would think.
Now, if I were the governor, I'd say wait a minute, fellas, let's not try that kind of monkey business.
Last question, the governor keeps saying that the White House will be helping in this gubernatorial campaign in 86 trying to keep his margin down, his plurality down if in fact he's to win.
How do you feel about that? Do you expect to get a lot of help if you run from the White House?
I have absolutely no knowledge of what the White House position would be on this. There has been no communication on the subject nor would the Republican National Committee.
And so the governor's statement is totally speculative and at this point without any foundation, whatever in fact.
Obviously, Senator, as this develops, we'll be checking in with you from time to time, hoping to get this side and important side of the way in which the campaign is developing. Thank you very much.
Thank you, Alan. Good to talk to you.
I'm here with my editor, producer and friend, Bill Graulty. Bill, this is sort of an amazing tape of Roy Goodman, isn't it?
Well, Alan, I'm still trying to figure out whether it was an interview or a campaign speech. Either way, it was quite a litany of charges against Governor Cuomo by Senator Goodman.
What I'm wondering from you is who is a speech like that directed at?
It is, of course, something that I was wondering about as he was giving it. After all, when you start hearing things like charges about economic development, that is good stuff for people who have money, who have businesses, but it really isn't the kind of thing that charges the electorate all that much.
So we have to assume at this stage of the game you have a liberal senator from the east side of Manhattan who is trying to win his party's nomination to become Governor.
And as you know, in the Republican Party, liberals of any stripe, including Republican liberals, are highly suspect, so that when you get a conservative in a primary now, not a general election, but in a primary which you have to win to be the candidate, very often the liberal Republican loses to the more doctraniar conservative.
If that's what the nature of the opposition is going to be. So it's not strange to see Roy Goodman beginning to talk the kind of thing that Republican conservatives want to hear.
And one of those more than anything else is the development of business in New York State and the business climate.
And that's what I think is really going on here with all of that attention paid. Of course, the other thing that he's doing is giving us a pretty good look into what the election is going to look like.
And he must have all kinds of research people out there because you could just hear him clicking off those facts one after another.
The Michael Sinifere, the economic development, how Bill Stern double crossed the governor. That's the kind of stuff that major political operatives prepare for you. It's what's called negative research. Both sides do it.
Well, is the public going to really get turned on to the fact that for instance, Vincent T.C., the governor's economic development man, is not a financier as Senator Goodman pointed out.
I mean, other people in Utica are going to all of a sudden say, oh my gosh, we better throw a quomal out of office.
Well, I think what he was trying to establish there was not so much Vincent T.C., but a pattern in which he's going to try to lay on the governor that he can't keep good health, that he doesn't find good health.
And there was one really intriguing thing that may lead to dirty politics later on. And he said, if you remember that the governor doesn't know about a payroll.
Now, payroll is an interesting word in Mario Cuomo's background because you may remember that his associate Bill Cabin, who worked for him when he was lieutenant governor, did some criminal things, served jail time, put some people on the payroll.
And I'm sure they're waiting to try that one out if unless I miss my guess later on. However, none of that worked in the last election and it was much fresher then. So I don't see why it's going to work now.
How does Senator Roy Goodman stand on the horizon right now? See the tallest among the Republicans, would you say?
Your introduction to all of this was exactly right. It seems to me that anybody right now, of course the governor always says something like Sinas Nguyenu Bob, which means between now and then a new pope may be born.
But right now this governor is enjoying historic popularity ratings. Don't forget every time that Nelson Rockefeller ran for governor, he was losing before he actually ran.
And you carry was no great popular guy in the state at the point he ran for a second term. So here is a governor enjoying unprecedented popularity. Incredible.
70% and above approval ratings in the poll, it seems to me that any Republican who wants this nomination has got to be on a kamikaze mission to some degree and may be looking for a position in the White House, maybe looking at what I mean by that is some secretariat.
You do a good job, you run against the governor, you keep his plurality down and then we'll reward you later on. We'll send you to Washington, maybe ambassador, maybe something else because after all the Republicans in Washington know that this governor is potential trouble.
And if they're able to keep his plurality down in 1986, that's going to help them a great deal. So Roy Goodman seems to want this nomination, seems to want it a lot.
It's much to have senior political operatives working for him. He's got a lot of money as the governor keeps pointing out. He has ties to the X-Lax fortune and it seems clear to me that he'll be willing to spend some of that money.
As we say, we'll stay tuned on this one.
Thanks Bill. That's our show for this week. Join us again next week for another look at state government and politics.
Bill Graulty-Editton produces this program, Leslie Broko, as associate editor. Please address comments and questions to us at WAMC, Fox 13,000, Albany, New York, 1-2-1-2. I'm Alan Chartalk.
The legislative Gazette is a production of WAMC News. Alan Chartalk is executive producer. This program is made possible with funds provided by the state University of New York College at New Falls.
Thank you.
